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Accessible RP and Characters
Posted: Thu Sep 15, 2022 12:55 am
by Geras
Another issue (I mentioned in the other thread) is our accessibility of RP. And I wonder if we just need more characters that will get up to shenanigans for lack of a better word. Characters that go wrestle a Hillman or get into a barfight or whatever. Characters that aren't about acquiring power.
We still have those, but not as many as we used to. Is anyone interested in rolling one? Is there a way we can do something to encourage that archetype?
Re: Accessible RP and Characters
Posted: Thu Sep 15, 2022 8:02 am
by mystry
I sometimes hear this, and I often think that it comes about only because most players aren't aware of all the shenanigans that do happen on grid; not every shenanigan is visible to the public or physically harmful. But more important than that, the simple facts are that:
A. Most people aren't violent or confrontational or controversial by nature, and this extends to their characters.
B. No one wants to get dogpiled by IC rumors for doing something out of line.
C. No one wants their character to suffer IC consequences for doing something out of line.
D. That avoidance of consequences is the case regardless of whether they're minor (like a lashing) or major (like pyring).
E. Rewards like recommend levels and XP and QP are not (and probably never will be) sufficient to overcome the emotional impact of having consequences happen to a character. At least not for what seems to be the vast majority of people.
Re: Accessible RP and Characters
Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 3:47 pm
by Geras
That's my point though - the shenanigans aren't visible and don't draw people in. We care too much about our characters. Maybe alts that aren't social climbers?
Re: Accessible RP and Characters
Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 3:56 pm
by Myrella
This issue would solve itself if staff offered a greater reward than just 100% death XP if you get executed to characters that instigate drama.
Re: Accessible RP and Characters
Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 4:12 pm
by astronamika
Geras wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 3:47 pm
That's my point though - the shenanigans aren't visible and don't draw people in. We care too much about our characters. Maybe alts that aren't social climbers?
Myrella wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 3:56 pm
This issue would solve itself if staff offered a greater reward than just 100% death XP if you get executed to characters that instigate drama.
Yeah, this. I'm also curious how much time-grinding it takes for a typical newbie to get their character fully equipped and to a point where their shenanigans wouldn't immediately fall flat, because this could be something we see change with new assets and freer-flowing money.
For small-time antagonists or underworld movers who probably won't see the gallows when they die, by the time you're capable and your rec% is high, you've invested a lot of time. Obviously the reward's supposed to be the story, but rpxp takes a long time to grind up, so maybe the solution lies in making playing a small-time antagonist more rewarding/less of an investment somehow, or consider why players might not think the story they get is worth the big chunk of rpxp and time it'd take to buy in.
On the player side, I recall having a discussion some time ago about encouraging vs. discouraging reactions to antagonism. It goes a long way if players try to angle their reactions to build their enemies up (in the vein of "he has the whole neighbourhood terrorized!") vs shutting them down by dumping on their characters or downplaying their efforts (I've literally seen a meta rumour comment about how "Lithmore's worst bard couldn't write a character this bad", like, c'mon), etc.
Re: Accessible RP and Characters
Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 4:30 pm
by monolu
I'm not sure if increasing the reward for being executed really matters. People will get attached to characters they spend hundreds of hours embodying regardless if dying means they get something really cool.
Usually, the risks of doing shenanigans far outweigh the potential benefits. This means that people are pretty hesitant to do them unless they're playing a character that they're okay with losing. I think this creates a paradoxical situation. Characters which you don't care about losing are probably ones that you haven't invested a lot of time into, but this probably also means that they might be lacking in crucial skills to facilitate said shenanigans. At the same time, the characters who are competent enough to actually get up to some shenanigans are hesitant because they've invested all this time into their character and don't want to face potentially deadly consequences.
I understand that the theme is supposed to be oppressive, and this definitely adds to that. I also think that the game would be a lot more fun for everyone if conflicts were more visible. I'm not sure how to solve this, but I feel like adding some way to cause some minor shenanigans or spooks without the very real risk of your established character dying or being exposed as a criminal or heretic would be beneficial.
Re: Accessible RP and Characters
Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 5:51 pm
by Myrella
monolu wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 4:30 pm
I'm not sure if increasing the reward for being executed really matters. People will get attached to characters they spend hundreds of hours embodying regardless if dying means they get something really cool.
Usually, the risks of doing shenanigans far outweigh the potential benefits. This means that people are pretty hesitant to do them unless they're playing a character that they're okay with losing. I think this creates a paradoxical situation. Characters which you don't care about losing are probably ones that you haven't invested a lot of time into, but this probably also means that they might be lacking in crucial skills to facilitate said shenanigans. At the same time, the characters who are competent enough to actually get up to some shenanigans are hesitant because they've invested all this time into their character and don't want to face potentially deadly consequences.
I understand that the theme is supposed to be oppressive, and this definitely adds to that. I also think that the game would be a lot more fun for everyone if conflicts were more visible. I'm not sure how to solve this, but I feel like adding some way to cause some
minor shenanigans or spooks without the very real risk of your established character dying or being exposed as a criminal or heretic would be beneficial.
I wasn't proposing greater rewards for being executed per se. But for many of the same reasons you outline here, greater rewards for instigating drama could do wonders for the game. Creating a character is a lot of work. Establishing a character is a lot more work and TIME. The risk vs reward for putting that character in antagonistic positions is hardly ever worth it. You get caught committing crimes, the reputational damage alone can be a soft-death of a character.
Re: Accessible RP and Characters
Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 6:06 pm
by monolu
Myrella wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 5:51 pm
I wasn't proposing greater rewards for being executed per se. But for many of the same reasons you outline here, greater rewards for instigating drama could do wonders for the game. Creating a character is a lot of work. Establishing a character is a lot more work and TIME. The risk vs reward for putting that character in antagonistic positions is hardly ever worth it. You get caught committing crimes, the reputational damage alone can be a soft-death of a character.
Totally agree! Some kind of reward for creating drama would be amazing.
Re: Accessible RP and Characters
Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2022 11:00 pm
by Annalesa
Myrella wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 3:56 pm
100% death XP if you get executed to characters that instigate drama.
If this is true, I find these terms acceptable. XP erosion, even with recommends, was the largest part of it for me. I know it's not an automatic, but that's just a reason to put on a bigger show.