Log of OOC Meeting 2022-08-20

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Sat Aug 20, 2022 6:24 pm

Ghed states, "Alright, I'll begin, if anyone has a topic to raise, please tell me"

Ghed nods at Urtha.

Ghed states to Urtha, "Thanks"

Leta claims to Urtha, "That would be great."

Tomato says, "I don't have a topic, but I'm still riding the high of discovering pitchers were updated"

Urtha says, "Shoot I shoulda waited for deedee. Now I got responsibilities :P"

Leta grins.

Deedee grins.

Leta asks, "And QP, at least?"

Tomato says, "I want to invite people to myphome immediately so I can pour them wine from my fancy pitcher"

Ghed says, "Okay, time to start this week's Staff Update."

Mutters muses, "Uh...I had...newbie experience and combat topics, one of which is on the forums?"

Ghed says to Mutters, "Of course1"

Ghed claims, "Okay I'll begin"

NotACannibal states, "I'll come share wine with you"

Eurus claws his way out of the codebase. [OOC]

Leta waves.

Ghed has transferred Brando. [OOC]

Ghed gives a wooden deck of cards, painted with a court of regal birds to Brando.

Ghed gives a wooden deck of cards, painted with a court of regal birds to Eurus.

Ghed has transferred Crayon. [OOC]

Ghed gives a wooden deck of cards, painted with a court of regal birds to Crayon.

Ghed pontificates, "Welcome! We were doing staff updates"

Ghed states, "This week I dedicated myself to the Lothos plot, trying to keep things rolling and fair and fun. Please try to do your best to include other players even if they are not your guildies or allies, and try to stick to the objectives I laid"

Ghed states, "Other than that we had a LOT of recommendations, player requests, and typoes"

Ghed queries to Leta, "Wanna give us your weekly update?"

Leta nods.

Leta claims, "I spent most of my time on the physicians' mini-plot this week! Thank you to all who participated in the new disease implementation, especially those who were willing to get infected for a good cause."

Leta says, "I also worked through some of the usual typos, recommends and requests."

Anonymous states, "I had to lance a pus filled wound."

Ghed claims, "I heard that plot was a lot of fun"
Anonymous states, "It was great."

Leta grins.

Leta says, "Glad to hear it."

Ghed says, "Eurus has been very busy, but he was able to do a MAJOR update to the travel command. It's more efficient, takes WAY less time to compute and lags the game less."

Ghed claims, "He also coded and rolled out the new disease of course, and fixed a gazillion bugs"

Ghed states, "(two new diseases actually)"

Deedee wonders, "Any functional change to it? will the routes still be the same as before?"

Ghed states, "Yes but in one-millionth of time"

Deedee nods.

Ghed queries to Eurus, "Right boss?"

Ghed says, "(short distances may get a hiccup as we fine-tune the new math)"

Eurus says, "Something like that, will need further updates but it's a temporary thing for the moment"

Deedee says, "I'll try not to fall off any roofs."

Ghed muses, "Alright people, let's move on to Player Heartbeat: how has the week been for y'all?"

Deedee says, "Been good, busy"

Tomato says, "It has been a delight to wiggle back into RP on this guy"

Qitarah claims, "Enjoying this character so far! People have been pretty welcoming."

Ghed says, "Sounds like all good news in my book"

Ghed queries, "Alright, is there anything bothering anyone about TI that can be shared here and now?"

Effie says, "It's been good, the new moneymaking guide actually solved my problems wrt the game feeling stagnant as a newbie, though im still inclined to believe new newbies who say they're struggling too much, cause i had to dump in a pretty big investment"

Effie says, "But personally im very placated and feel like i have active tasks to pursue instead of passive watch staring"

Caius states, "I've been around for only 2 days so I cant complain"

Brando claims, "I was online for 60+hrs wwith 30hrs of RP ..and hulda made some critical milestones this week. over 50levels of teach now :)"

Leta declares to Caius, "Welcome!"

Ghed says, "I'm very glad, the new guide is just a mixmash of Philly's advice on the forums plus things I know and have done across my alts."

Ghed exclaims to Brando, "Congratulations!"

Mutters says, "Yeah, my week has been amazing. Busy, but amazing. I can't get done all the crafting I need because of roleplay and I'm roleplaying so much that I can't get my orders in, so that's a great problem to have."

Leta declares to Brando, "Very exciting. Congrats!"

Effie says, "Have already been made fun of because oocly i get fixated on caius's exact character type, so welcome"

Brando says, "Cheers"

Mutters says, "And every time I roleplay my orders list grows."

Leta grins.

Caius says, "I need a tailor"

Caius claims, "Thats all I have to whine about"

Crayon states, "I've mostly had a good week. Been running into a few stumbling blocks here and there and trying to find a way to navigate around them. The way assets work and the time it takes for there to be an ROI is a bit concerning for me economically."

Leta pontificates to Caius, "There are several of those!"

Ghed declaims to Caius, "That's a good problem to have!"

Ghed nods at Crayon.

Ghed pontificates to Crayon, "Noted!"

Ghed says, "Alright, time to move on to Player Topics."

Ghed wonders to Mutters, "You're first, what's your issue?"

Mutters claims, "As for newbie experience, there's a thread on the forums about how to make money, and while I haven't had any issues with it, being a merchant and really promoting that I can make things, someone with a bit less uptime or a bit less marketable skills like a bard may be having some issues with money, but what I found is that setting up an asset isn't bad at all either. I figure 50-75 silver a week seems really good? And the 600 silver to start is plenty enough to get things done, provided I guess there's some real push to start with RP first and get to know people who can make you things. Everyone has been super welcoming and amazing, so no complaints there. I just think there's a lot of good discussion on the forums for money and the onboarding experience."

Urtha states, "Delayed cause I was doing laundry. But RP was good and a little busy for me."

Leta nods at Urtha.

Leta states to Urtha, "Glad to hear it."

Leta nods at Mutters.

Mutters claims, "But yeah, a lot of that has been resolved by the "how to make money" helpfile, like Effie said."

Ghed says, "I'm glad you all liked it, I enjoyed writing it"

Mutters says, "I just wanted to draw some attention to the forum topic and the help, because there's some new players coming in"

Effie nods.

Tomato states, "RE: merchants, the 'guildlist merchant' is publically available and is IC information, so as far as I go, I usually work off of that"

Mutters says, "And a lot of good discussion"

Deedee says, "It's good to find a niche. some successful ones I've seen are selling supplies for crafting, and breeding horses"

Tomato says, "So bother your merchant GL to update your subrank if it doesn't list all your trades"

Anonymous states, "If you're lucky you can find characters around with those skills who arent in the merchants"

Anonymous claims, "As well"

Crayon states, "I've really been enjoying the Lothos plot. There are a few things about it that are difficult to act on, but on the whole it's been a lot of fun for spurring RP."

Tomato pontificates, "It's hard to do that without just standing in the middle of town and shouting 'I need a new shirt!'"

Mutters claims, "Aah ok. I do need to get my stuff put up there."

Anonymous says, "Shouting 'i need a new shirt' upon entering a tavern is a good conversation starter"

Effie claims, "As a returning player i am kind of appreciating again how much this game does rely on undocumented game knowledge / rp culture knowledge in a way that i have seen limiting some newbies, i think theres a thread about that too"

Ghed exclaims to Crayon, "Let me know afterwards how I can make things more enjoyable!"

Deedee grins at Anonymous.

Caius queries, "Oh right where do I find info on Lothos stuff? Like is there a post? board? for references"

Ghed nods at Caius.

Mutters states, "I also had the thing on Combat if we're done with the first issue. XD"

Effie says to Caius, "Try 'help domain lothos' for starters"

Ghed states to Caius, "Hit board ic, then note read 25"

Deedee says, "Also plot header review 66"

Deedee claims, "And on the IC board"

Ghed wonders to Mutters, "Okay, anything else on this issue?"

Tomato states, "Where is this 'newbie experience' post on the forum, though, I only saw the money one"

Effie claims to Tomato, "It's the idea board post about the IC laws etc"

Mutters says, "Oh, the newbie experience stuff is wrapped up in the money one. A little bit about how it's hard to onboard with starting wealth, and then yeah, Crayon posted some stuff about law on the idea board. Those are the two."

Urtha queries, "Do a lot of newbies not know about their starting asset?"

Ghed muses to Effie, "Okay, why don't you share your issue with us?"

Ghed claims to Urtha, "(good question)"

Effie declaims, "Sure! mine's actually just a short uhh"

Leta nods at Mutters.

Effie claims, "I actually bring this up only because I've had good experiences on grid along these lines personally, but even if you're ICly enemies with someone, it's very much believable and realistic to form a tense allyship and collaborate on things like the Lothos plot purely because of politics, and it makes your character look like a badass who can set asside personal stuff for the greater good. So I'm just here to push the "don't feel like you have to stick to a blood feud" angle if anyone's feeling limited by IC animosity"

Caius pontificates, "I remember I had a starting asset! I'll figure it out later lol"

Ghed says to Effie, "Absolutely true"

Effie trails off, "I've heard people saying the opposite of my experience so it's a good excuse to like ... drop some murder wishes if you want"
Leta claims, "Nothing like a rebellion to bring enemies together."

Tomato states, "Say I have long maintained that the asset system is confusing and difficult for new players, particularly when it seems to default to giving the most garbage assets available"

Deedee claims, "Also totally good to stab in the back to further your own goal towards it."

Ghed claims, "It's good to remember that there's nothing wrong with allying with your opposition towards a mutual win"

Leta nods at Tomato.

Ghed nods at Deedee.

Leta nods at Deedee.

Effie declares, "It makes you a good politician if youre high ranking socially!"

Ghed claims, "Or to help a faction win because you want their perk"

Effie says to Ghed, "Shh dont tell them that part >_>"

Urtha claims, "Yeah getting familiar with all the commands and especially the POLCAs as a newbie is a bit heavy. I still have to reread help files when sending messengers and stuff. And I'm intimidated by all the plot stuff."

Deedee says, "Yeah, POLCA is a bit of a cludge"

Caius states, "The plot stuff sounds fun, you learn a lot from the big players in the game"

Tomato claims, "I feel like re: most of these newbie experience threads, it seems the underlying thing is that they aren't being given the benefit of the doubt during cyan period and/or not asking questions/being given advice"

Leta queries to Urtha, "Is there anything you think we could do to help?"

Effie nods at Tomato.

Tomato says, "Like the laws one, I believe I know what that is in regards to, that could have been mitigated by a pboard by the experienced player, since we should be defaulting to assuming they are brand spankin new"

Crayon claims, "The asset mechanic is a little intimidating but it starts to make sense fairly quickly. It's just I feel like certain city metrics are kind of getting wrecked by a bug that caused a lot of projects, supports, etc. to slip from that metric to another so it's easy to wind up with a brick metric on your starting asset."

Tomato claims, "But that would require non-new cyans to stop being rude ASF when people assume they are new"

Leta nods at Tomato.

Effie states, "I have noticed a few cases here where someone has taken some feedback i had and just stuck all the worst intentions to it and argued with me on a point i wasn't making rofl"

Effie says, "Thats more of a good faith game culture thing though"
Tomato states, "Because some people get extremely rude when you reach out helpfully to confirm they know what they're doing before acting on it, as if you insulted their entire family line"

Leta queries, "It feels like we're getting a bit off track here. Are we done with Effie's topic about antagonism and unlikely allies?"

Effie claims, "Yes"

Ghed nods.

Deedee claims, "Some metrics are more routinely high or low than others"

Leta nods.

Ghed muses to Mutters, "You had a brief topic to add?"

Mutters nods.

Mutters states, "So on the subject of Combat, I can type in Combat and it says if I'm pathetic and all that or if I'm proficient, and I know my skills to stats, but I don't know if there's a compare command if I'm looking at like a boar or a mangy mutt, I don't know if my current setup is able to take them, or if I'm going to get an injury, so if there was some way to know, that would be neat, but also if that's a function of RP with the Reeves and sparring and all? That's good too, I just didn't have a guidepost for what that looks like, and the people I asked on Visnet all seemed to have no idea how combat works."

Anonymous claims, "There is not a compare command"

Deedee says, "There used to be."

Urtha says, "For me its just the wall of text, and all the individual commands that are different in one polca vs another, and sometimes having to figure them out despite the help files. It's just a lot to get to grips with when you're also busy with personal plots, grinding skills, writing letters and what not else. No specific suggestions though."

Gnomely is idle.

Leta declares, "Let's return to the topic of newbie-friendliness and culture after we finish the registered topics!"

Gnomely is no longer idle.
Gnomely has returned from AFK.

Anonymous states, "In my experience you learn what you can hulksmash by trying to hulksmash it and running away if it starts hulksmashing you"

Tomato states, "Sorry, I had not realized we had started topics"

Leta nods at Urtha.

Tomato says, "But re: compare, that's more a hack and slash game thing"

Ghed claims to Mutters, "There's not a compare command presently, and you can spar with anyone"

Deedee says, "I think they're more worried about PVE, and not getting their throat ripped out by a bunny."

Tomato states, "We don't really want to encourage people to attack random animals because the injury system does not work the same as a hack and slash"

Tomato states, "However unless there is a [L] by the name, it won't kill you"

Deedee states, "As a doctor, I want to encourage people to attack random animals."

Ghed snorts

Anonymous states, "Unless its a bird"

Effie claims, "Punch a buffalo"

Caius asks, "What does the L mean?"

Anonymous states, "If you attack a bird and i see it"

Anonymous states, "You will not like what happens"

River claims, "Kill all birds."

Tomato states, "It means Lethal"

Anonymous pontificates, "I have punched a buffalo before!"

Caius claims, "Ah ok"

Crayon questions, "Can we give all bunnies an {x?"

Effie says, "Dont kill birds anon and i will kill you back"

Mutters claims, "So as Anonymous says, it's sort of an exploration feel where you sort of try it and see what happens? The core of the issue was that I felt kind of stonewalled with Leather when I don't feel a comfortable with hunting, but then I found out that you can raise rabbits with animal husbandry and get pelts that turn into leather from them, and basically set up leather farms, so combat isn't as big of an issue as I thought it was."

Tomato states, "But all actions you take are IC, so unless you have a reason to be hunting animals, we don't want just everyone doing it just because they're bored"

Ghed claims, "It takes a lot of time though"

Anonymous trails off, "So in terms of hunting specifically..."

Deedee nods.

Ghed nods at Tomato.

Anonymous claims, "There are certain animals that are 'leather sources'"

Anonymous claims, "That are weak combat wise"

Deedee claims, "There's also another alternative for hunting"

Anonymous states, "But give out a bunch o leather when you tan their hides and stuff"

Anonymous claims, "I generally go looking for them if i want leather"

Deedee says, "You can buy hunting dogs or other combat-enabled retainers"

Ghed nods at Deedee.
Tomato says, "That would be, assumedly, deer and other animals commonly hunted for leather"

Ghed claims, "Or hawks if you have a hawk glove"

Anonymous claims, "Also, don't be afraid to seek out other PCs who might know about fighting or hunting"

Anonymous says, "And ask them about it"

Mutters claims, "My character is set up as a woodsman/hunter so that's sort of really in character for him. Aah yeah, so is that something I ask around, probably with the Reeves IC."

Ghed nods.

Deedee says, "Hawks for small game, yes"

Anonymous says, "It can be an RP moment or trip or somesuch"

Anonymous states, "Reeves are like cops but that might work"

Mutters asks, "Is it the knights that would be the contact?"

Tomato says, "As far as combat code, I'd say the most important thing is wear armor if you are starting a fight, and you can flee if things get sticky, but animals do tend to roll with randomized stats within a block"

Ghed claims, "I have a project on my lap to develop hunting traps in the future"

Tomato claims, "So it is actually hard to say 'this will for sure kill x animal'"

Mutters says, "Oooh trapping, i love that"

Deedee states, "I think even freemen now can have up to 10 animal retainers. 10 hunting dogs with 'order all attack deer snaps at the deer' should bring it down in one shot."

Ghed nods at Tomato.

Crayon says, "It might be good to put together guides on how to dip into the various crafting paths, how best to get the resources for them, et cetera, insofar as it's possible to without providing IC information. Fishing traps would be cool, too. :D"

Ghed has transferred Petal. [OOC]

Ghed gives a wooden deck of cards, painted with a court of regal birds to Petal.

River ponders.

Petal states, "Thank you."

River muses, "Can you mattack while flying?"

Tomato muses, "I think so?"

Ghed claims to River, "Nope"

Ghed says, "It was disabled after a lot, and I mean a lot, of griefing"

Deedee claims, "Used to be able to, but was removed I think"

Mutters states, "I mean specifically this is the kind of discussion I was hoping to have is like...how do I do the things I'm trying to do with the character, and then bring people along with him, because like there are 'soft' characters in game that want to see the forest, but need a woodsman guide? And I want to be able to protect them."

Leta states, "We do pay QP for people who are willing to write guides on the forums"

Tomato says, "Oh, I see"

River says, "Guess you can't contact a witch for leather then. Darn."

Leta declares, "So if someone is willing to share their knowledge, please do!"

Tomato claims, "I would really advise utilizing visnet for these sorts of questions"

Tomato claims, "We do our best to answer every question and that is its exact purpose"

Effie nods.

Tomato says, "There are no stupid questions and we all understand what it was like to be new and bewildered"

Deedee nods.

Ghed wonders to Mutters, "Anything else?"

Deedee states, "Game has a pretty steep learning curve, but that's because there's so much you can do."

Tomato claims, "And there are so many character archetypes and options that its hard to write a for-sure guide for everything"

Effie says, "Some people arent used to the range of acceptable questions on here because a lot of other games with just say "find out icly" but afaik its better to just ask"

Mutters states, "Nope! Seems like I know where to go. :D"

Effie states, "Will just*"

Effie says, "I cannot typing today"

Ghed claims to Effie, "I remember finding that very unusual when I began here"

Tomato says, "Essentially if you aren't sure of the answer, you can always ask on visnet"

Effie claims to Ghed, "I know which dirty mud slum you grew up in"

Crayon states, "Find out IC is a bit of a meme, especially since it's almost never an 'IC' question."

Tomato states, "There are some things we have to say 'ask IC' like 'who do I buy X from' "

Ghed claims to Effie, "Lol"

Caius says, "I grew up in Sindome so I am used to foic"

Tomato says, "But actual mechanical questions or 'how do I' stuff, or even 'is this an OK concept' are all a-OK to ask"

Ghed states to Crayon, "It's very passive-aggressive sometimes, specially if just tossed out cold"

Effie claims, "Rofl yes"

NotACannibal claims, "I neve rliked foic"

River claims, "Mud I came from wouldn't even tell newbs what stats were good for their character class on the newbie channel."

Ghed says, "Yeah, I don't like that"

Ghed claims, "I dislike old players having an unsurmountable advantage of that sort"

Crayon claims, "Well, ICly you probably know where to buy a lot of things. Like if I ask where can I buy a pack of cigarettes and there's only one place in the modern game that sells them that's not actually an IC question and it's super jarring if somebody asks it IC."

Tomato states, "We try to be much more welcoming than that"

Ghed nods.

Mutters says, "I mean like...you can say it in a good way like "We'd like to encourage player interaction by nudging you to develop a friend in character that will help achieve that goal.""

Tomato says, "I think if you're asking which NPC shop, thats an OK visnet question, but not 'which merchant player' "

Crayon claims, "But I imagine that's why we have the awesome directory command. :3"

Ghed nods at Mutters.

Leta says, "Alright. It seems like folks wanted to discuss a bit more about newbie culture/support, so we're open the floor to that. If anyone else has formal topics, shoot Ghed a tell"

Anonymous claims, "I have no problem coughing up a shop name/location for regular things"

Ghed pontificates to Crayon, "It's so useful!"

Anonymous says, "If you're asking me where to buy deathsdream"

Anonymous claims, "That one I'm gonna need a justification for"

Anonymous claims, "Lol"

Effie says, "If youre gonna buy deathsdream that one's a question for me"

Deedee wonders, "Now you'd probably be given the um what's that new command?"

Ghed says, "Brew it yourself like a champ"

Urtha claims, "It would be neat if there were more accessible IC resources for the questions that get told "Ask IC" Maybe more books or something. Laws and rules posted on public boards etc."

Deedee queries, "To search for shops that sell x?"

Effie nods at Anonymous.

Tomato says, "But those types of questions, re: deathsdream, you might want to explain 'that is a poison and maybe you should consider where one could get a poison'"

Tomato states, "Rather than just 'find out IC' because thats not constructive or helpful"

Mutters claims, "Oh! I had a thing. I'm walking around to all of the shops and getting a list of prices and items."

Tomato claims, "Prices do change with the economy metric, be warned"

Mutters states, "I think someone asked if that was an option, and I think I can put it in an spreadsheet or something."

Brando is idle.

Leta declares to Tomato, "Not just the economy metric!"

Brando is no longer idle.
Brando has returned from AFK.

Tomato says, "Oh, economy metric + I guess"

Anonymous states, "Rare goods will show up in some shops based on metrics"

Mutters states, "Aah, so I mean at least I'll have a sort of baseline, I think."

Crayon muses, "I feel like there should definitely be both some IC and OOC resource with information on all applicable laws, but still vague enough to allow Reeves latitude to be individuals and not robots. Knowing what the acceptability levels of various drugs, for example, would be helpful as I expect it's not actually aligned ICly with what the actual helpfiles or craft info for the drugs say for them?"

Leta trails off, "Different shops, quarters and types of material change price for metrics, season..."

Tomato states, "I agree that the laws and the helpfiles don't often agree and it can be difficult for new players when that clashes and one isn't updated"

Deedee claims, "I believe there's an IC book of laws. maybe it should be placed in the grand library"

Tomato says, "That got me yelled at IC when I tried to bring it up in osays though, so I never pursued it"

Anonymous says, "Out of curiosity is there a particular law you're thinking of"

Leta questions, "Do you feel like help drugs and help summary of laws aren't up-to-date?"

Petal states, "Being in the grand library wouldn't help newbies much, I haven't.. yet found it."

Ghed claims to Mutters, "I'd rather players discovered the economy by themselves, but no problem if you share it with friends"

River says, "I have no idea if they're up to date or not because I don't know what the actual laws are."

Deedee claims, "Travel grand library from crossroads will get ya there"

Mutters says, "To ghed Aah, ok. That sounds good."

Tomato claims, "In my instance I was using a drug and it was apparently finable despite listed as 'lower class but acceptable' in the help drug"

Anonymous says, "Its in the northwest part of the city. It has 'library' in its room names so you can travel there"

Petal claims, "Yeah but most newbies wouldn't know to even look for it, or that'd be where to find laws."

Caius claims, "The book is Queen's Law I think"

Anonymous claims, "A lot of law enforcement is left up to individual reeve decision though fyi"

Tomato says, "And the Reeve took offense to my pointing out oocly that it didn't match, but we have new ones now who are probably less prickly"

Crayon claims, "I mean, I don't know personally if they're not up-to-date but I know that I and other newbies have been broached with law violations that aren't documented in either of those helpfiles or that are actually contradicted by other helpfiles. For example, the legal monopoly of the Merchants' Guild is not really explained as an actual legally enforced monopoly and the helpfile for the Merchants' Guild sort of implies that people CAN compete with them (they just lose)."

Ghed claims to Petal, "The laws are in helpfiles though"

Tomato queries, "That specific instance, we can probably update helpfiles for?"

Leta nods at Tomato.

Effie finishes abruptly, "Tbh i thought the ic policy with the merchants guild was just that - you could compete with them, but they'd be allowed to crush you or play dirty"

Ghed claims, "Oh, if it's unclear that sucks, we'll do something about it"

Anonymous claims, "They probably can. and they can call on the reeves to enforce their monopoly. i think"

Ghed states, "Just to be sure I put it in help making money."

Effie claims, "Unless like someone's playing 4D chess here and bribing the reeves to come across ICly like they're enforcers for the merchants guild when really thats not a thing"

Tomato queries, "I think it might have been set up that way a long time ago, but since the guildskills are locked behind membership as well, it may have changed over the years?"

Tomato says, "But you can absolutely, for example, sell stuff Southside"

Petal claims, "I had no idea help making money existed."

Tomato claims, "Or have a job listing"

Ghed claims to Petal, "I made it this week"

Crayon queries, "It's hard for a newbie to KNOW if the helpfiles are actually up to date. I couldn't say if help drugs, for example, is accurate. I guess I have to snort some coamjar in front of a reeve and find out IC?"

Petal claims, "Ahh."

Ghed says to Petal, "I felt some of the talk in the forums had a lot of merit"

Leta states, "I moved help merchant monopoly over to the law index to make that more visible."

Ghed states, "We do our best to update the helpfiles as we go, yep"

Effie states, "Ahhh so it's not defined in the law"

Tomato states, "I think also there are some misunderstandings between ic and ooc--RE: the monopoly, its not liek you are going to be killed over it"

Tomato states, "But you could definitely be fined"

Ghed claims, "We do have a lot, and many that are for staff only to keep up t odate"

Effie says, "Help merchant monopoly implies it's not legally enforced"

Tomato claims, "I think a lot of people conflate 'illegal' with 'character ending' and that is frankly not true, on top of we have protections in place now to keep you from being perma-in-jail"

Effie claims, "Er enforced by reeves"

Deedee states, "Each help file does show the last modified date, which can help. If it's older than 2005, might want to ask"

Tomato claims, "It could be conflated as 'theft' per that helpfile, by a Reeve"

Anonymous states, "All im saying is that I have had seen merchants use the 'we'll call the reeves' threat when they come up against someone brekaing their monopoly before"

Crayon claims, "Well, Tomato, if your character isn't intended to be an active criminal and you do something illegal in front of a Reeve because it's not documented, even if it's not a character-ending offense it's sort of a character unmaking mistake."

Tomato says, "That is something the cyan period should cover and you should be able to go to ooc communication then, via osays"

Brando claims, "Disturbing the peace ..is a reeves best go to charge ..for many situations"

Effie nods.

Ghed claims to Brando, "It's great"

Tomato claims, "If someone does not respect your 'I did not know, please disregard and I will cease' that is then a policy issue"

Ghed nods at Tomato.

River says, "I mean... you can play for 75 hours and still not know plenty about the game."

Tomato claims, "During the cyan period you can change your character concept entirely and no one can say anything about it, it's totally fine. That does include accidentally breaking rules, if you claim that cyan protection, as well"

Petal says, "I tried the did not know angle, but it didn't really work."

Brando states, "I played for weeks before i realized there was even a help command"

Ghed claims, "You could make it to Implementor and still ignore some command"

Ghed claims to Brando, "Oooof"

Eurus states, "It should be noted a lot of these offenses/etc aren't likely to destroy your character, and will likely only lead to some low-rung conflict RP at most"

Ghed says, "Wrist slaps at worst, yeah"

Ghed claims, "It takes a lot to get the reeves moving"

Tomato asks, "I agree, and would add that that specific incident, it seems to have been forgotten quickly, as well? At least as far as I can see, probably because you didn't know"

Leta says, "As it comes to laws specifically: the book of laws on grid, and much of the pattern of enforcement on grid, is player-driven. Helpfiles define what the basic sins are, and what the basic laws are, as well as what can be punishable by death. The rest is up to players. It sounds like more than a law minutia issue, this is a supporting cyans issue, and a reminder to treat them as brand new players"

Effie claims, "Ive noticed a few characters who seemed to be giving cyans a discouragingly hard time soften up since the forum post though"

Crayon claims, "I've found the Reeves to be really cool and accommodating to newbie mistakes, personally."

Urtha says, "My account says over 1000 rp hours. There are guilds with commands and skills I've never been in or used. Plenty of shit here I don't know too."

Ghed states to Crayon, "That's great to hear"

Tomato claims, "I do agree this sounds more like a 'be nice to cyans'"

Leta nods at Tomato.

Effie nods.

Eurus claims, "Lots of reskinned topics, same general points"

Effie states, "Even if youre an oldbie a cyan character with no connections outside your comfort zone is hard (cries)"

Petal nods at Effie.

Effie claims, "Unbridled wailing"

Brando claims, "Its a lethal game we play here..character death should be expected... and its compensated with death XP ... recommends increase the percentage of rec u get ... u also earn QP formaking recommends... therefore i recommend that we all recommend each other when possible."

Effie declares, "Recs are awesome and i think we should all do them more!"

Leta nods at Effie.

Tomato states, "Eh, the game HAS shifted so that player death is not a daily occurrence, but the game IS set up to reward you if you do die"

Ghed says, "Alright, I think we have touched upon this and we agree, be nice to newbies or I'll have a word with you."

Leta states, "Seconded by staff! Approving recommends is my favorite part of the job."

Ghed claims, "Likewise"

Ghed claims, "It really brightens my TI day"

Mutters states, "Ah man, i got recommends and I haven't done any, so I'll put that on my list of things 'to do' :D"

Petal queries, "I've seen some people ask for recommends after a scene via osay. Is this generally okay or better to avoid?"

Ghed states, "It's okay, but not encouraged"

Tomato claims, "I usually send a recommend myself, rather than ask for them, because people typically send a recommend back, but I'd not ask for them, it comes off a bit desperate"

Ghed claims, "I -have- asked for recommends for players before my alt executes them though"

Leta nods at Tomato.

Effie says, "You can be a good hype man and remind people to rec antagonists in scenes or other MVP players you've noticed externally"

Tomato claims, "If you did something particularly risky or invetive and no one seems to notice, you CAN recommend yourself, but it gets looked at harder"

Ghed nods at Tomato.
Mutters trails off, "Lol "sorry I'm about to behad you, but like...give me a thumbs up on inquisition book""

Ghed states, "Definitely"

Ghed nods at Mutters.

Effie nods at Tomato.

Tomato claims, "So if you rob someone's house and leave all the cnotes and moods and stuff, you CAN tell staff you were a very good boy and can you please have a qp"

Tomato bats eyelashes at staff and wags his golden retriever tail

Effie states, "I get wildly excited over other peoples like clever writing moments so i love writing recs"

Leta says, "You also get QP for submitting recommends, so it's a two-way win."

Deedee claims, "You can recommend yourself, yes"

Brando queries, "I osay ask for a recommend if i feel i have done something worthy of it. nobodys going to blow my own horn so i have to do that u see?"

Effie claims, "Liky my iq drops by half when someone does something funny"

Ghed chuckles

Ghed nods at Brando.

Mutters questions, "On that subject, if I don't know what's worthy of a recommend, should I just do it anyway and you all will figure it out?"

Crayon states, "That's what I do."

Brando states, "Yes"

Eurus says, "Worst case they reject it and give you guidance on resending it in"

Tomato says, "Help recommend has good metrics"

Leta claims to Mutters, "The helpfile, help recommend, lists the guidelines. Worst case... yes, what Eurus says."
Mutters claims, "The helpfile on it is really good, so yeah, seems like a plan"

Effie states, "One really legit use of recommending yourself is if you're playing a mage or thief or other covert that could be killed if you're found out, and you've been dropping realistic or smart hints about it"

Eurus says, "It'll never be rejected without giving you feedback on it"

Ghed claims, "Ideally you want to ask yourself, does this recommend praise something someone did?. If the answer is yes then go. If it's 'no well but I like that they are funny' then probs rethink."

Petal claims, "I kinda suck at remembering after a scene, but I try to sit down once a week and do a few."

Ghed nods at Eurus.

Ghed says to Petal, "That's a good habit"

Eurus claims, "But even so, it's rare they get rejected unless it's something like 'they were cool, thanks', in which some more substance is usually requested"

Tomato states, "I try to send them out when I have good reasons or if its overdue, I'll list several reasons"

Effie nods.

Leta muses, "We really want to approve them, so if it's rejected, almost always it's, 'can you give more specifics?' 'can you elaborate on X and Y?'"

Ghed nods at Eurus.

Ghed nods at Leta.

Caius states, "I got a recommend last year, I just gotta rp it tight I imagine"

Crayon says, "Yeah, it seems more like as long as it's a recommend based on something they did rather than something they are it's probably good to go."

Mutters queries, "Ugh, so like I've had so many good scenes with people, can I put multiples of them in or just like a big one on someone with a bunch of notes?"

Leta nods at Crayon.

Brando states, "RP fun is generally not playing 'safely' in my opinion ok. i love generating hooks and finding out others secret hooks."

River lifts a wooden deck of cards, painted with a court of regal birds to their nose and sniffs at it.

Tomato states, "Do try to compliment themeliness, as well, if someone does something thematic, or embodies theme well, that's pretty much always approved"

Crayon says, "You can only put in one per person per weekly cycle."

Saga claims, "I get a little anxious over writing recommends, because the way the helpfile is laid out it really makes me feel like I'm submitting an assignment or something"

Ghed nods.

Saga states, "But that's probably just a me thing"

River states, "I feel that way, too."

Ghed states to Saga, "Oh I'm sorry you feel that way"

Ghed states to River, "Same"

Effie says to Saga, "Your last rec you send me almost made me cry it was so nice"

Ghed states, "It's just a warm pat on the back"

Effie says, "Sent* still cant with the language today"

Saga melts

Petal claims, "I feel like that too Saga."

River says, "The helpfile is like "THIS IS SERIOUS" and then the reality is like "do w/e idk" for a few things."
Urtha states, "Ohmygod get a room you two"

Mutters says, "For Cnotes I just put his boring old day to day and I feel like that's going to get really boring for people to read."

Eurus claims, "The guidelines are mostly there for Staff, but they're just transparent so you all know what goes into how much rec or QP they're worth"

Brando states, "I leave meaking recommends for the end of the week just before the ooc meeting... seems to be a good timeslot for that.. as u have had time to contemplate what u are recommeneding them for ..over thecourse of the in-game month ok."

Tomato states, "I suck at cnotes unless its something policy mandated of me"

Mutters questions, "Oh, when is the weekly tickover between week to week?"

Ghed states, "Saturday midnight"

emote is just joshin
Urtha is just joshin

Ghed states, "So in 5 hours"

Mutters claims, "And I get the autoscream for RP so I know when to Cnote and when to hidden and think"

Ghed says, "This renews assets too"

Effie states to Urtha, "I was trying to come up with a witty clap back but its not gonna happen"

Leta states, "Though some things are on a biweekly cycle, like influence and city metrics."

Ghed nods.

Tomato states, "I also suck at thinking as well"

Effie trails off, "Dunce club..."

NotACannibal claims, "My int is a glorious 35."

Tomato says, "I either think too much or not enough"

Mutters says, "Do I think in hillman or do I think in lithmorean? Sometimes I kind of do either."

River claims, "Such a tiny int."

Effie says, "Head empty"

River claims, "No thoughts."

Effie trails off, "35 int..."

NotACannibal claims, "Listen if you can't think then you can't be sad"
Urtha asks, "Yeah but what's your character's int?"

Leta states, "Thinks are one of those things that aren't seen 90 percent of the time, but when they are, they make the other person's day."

Effie nods.

Mutters says, "Because the language syntax is a lot better in native language than his non-native tongue"

Brando claims, "Stats are fine at any level IMO .. its dice rolls based on stats and emoting with stats and or skills that is key "

Leta claims, "Our sneaky friends appreciate it, I'm sure."
Tomato states, "I always worry from the now-defunct sister game that someone's going to suss out who I am from my thoughts"
Urtha states, "Recommends are great in both directions. I do wish I could see the ones I sent too"

Tomato states, "Because it had literal thought police"

Mutters trails off, "So i don't want it to be like...jarring when he speaks one way and he thinks in a better syntax"

Anonymous says, "COUGH"

Deedee asks, "Which sister game?"

Anonymous coughs overtly.

Effie claims, "Hey guys wanna hear a story"

Effie states, "About the thought police"

Anonymous states, "Stop effie"

Anonymous says, "Dont you even"

River states, "Thinking is nice. "

Tomato claims, "Also I get embarassed because my character thinks inappropriate things, but i blush typing it sometimes"

Caius states, "I am the police"

Ghed claims, "No blush"

Tomato states, "Its so hard for some reason to be like 'think damn nice tits'"

Eurus waves.

Anonymous trails off, "I am... THE LAW"

Petal snorts.

Eurus grabs his net and jumps into the code, ready to go bughunting. [OOC]

Tomato flushes and kicks the ground.

Effie claims to Tomato, "I choose to believe thats not you doing an impression of your other character, but it's your character here's thoughts"

Tomato says, "Lmaooo. You'll never know unless you get up in his brain"

Effie claims, "Just completely anachronistic talking in theme"

River says, "There's a suggestion on the forums for that."

Brando laughs

Effie claims, "But think damn nice tits"

Deedee states, "That is a thought (heh), currently you can think in a language with language codes, but by default it doesn't process as language"

Ghed calls for the Order

Deedee says, "Maybe thoughts should be in the language you're currently set to speak"

Tomato states, "I usually get purple prosey and be like 'that is a shapely maiden' instead "

Qitarah is idle.

Effie states, "Klsdfjkldsga ok thats even better"

Tomato trails off, "I am against thoughts being in languages by default because most people don't think in language, they just think... thoughts"

Tomato says, "Which are amorphous"

Anonymous states, "Apparently tomato that isn't the cas.e i dunno"

Deedee claims, "Depends"

Anonymous says, "I dont think in language but we are the exception"

Anonymous claims, "According to science"

Tomato states, "I can think 'omelette du fromage' when I am thinking specifically to think that french but"

Effie says, "I usually do emote thoughts that give vague suggestions of my character's feelings etc vs. actual dialogue"

Effie says, "Now you can all identify me .. ."

Petal states, "There's different ways to think. "

Tomato says, "I mean IRL I have ADHD so I literally never stop thinking"

Tomato states, "Just be glad I don't do that stream of consciousness at you"

Petal states, "Autistic. I overthink EVERYTHING. :D"

Crayon states, "We do tend to think in language (and dream in language, too). Linguists usually remember their first non-native language dream."

Ghed states, "Okay, I think we are more or less done here for today"

Tomato thinks, Wow, I'm thirsty. Little warm in here. Oh she's talking, I need to be quiet.

Brando says, "Are we really thinking of creating further barriers to 'mages' reading minds ability? I am against that as its hard enough being a mage already eh."

Ghed states, "Please remember to post rumors, cnote discoveries, and recommend each other for meaningful RP =)"

Saga states, "The language of thought is actually a massive thing in CogSci, it's pretty fascinating stuff"

Deedee nods.
River claims, "I just want to listen to the whinings of hedgehogs."

Deedee waves.

Tomato waves.

Leta exclaims, "It was lovely to see you all. Have a good night!"

Crayon waves.

Effie waves.

Leta waves.

Caius waves.

Mutters waves.

Ghed pontificates, "And please remember that we award 10 QP for a review of TI posted somewhere! Even if it's not favourable! Just drop us the link for your reward"

Ghed claims, "We rarely get reviews these days"

Mutters exclaims, "That's 240 Silver!"

Ghed trails off, "Okay, let's see... 3..."

Ghed trails off, "2..."

Caius states, "Just need someone active on reddit lol"

Ghed trails off, "1..."

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