On putting on armors

[Zeita]

EDIT 2: A point that Takta brought up in the OOC chat is that, during combat-heavy storyteller events, players don't really have an alternative to restoring their MV between fights other than scarfing down food. A storyteller command to simply restore everyone's MV if multiple fights are taking place would be helpful.

Thirdly, you talk about immersion-breaking behavior, would a ST restoring mv partway through battles not count as immersion breaking? What makes it any different than someone scarfing food down? Nothing! There is no difference. This is a freakin game, not a second chance at life or a way to escape your current life. It't just a way to have fun. Why do you think so many actual console games out there give people an option to heal between battles? Because they know people don't want to wait around for the health to restore. They don't want to experience real life in a game meant to be fun. Yes, realism is nice, but it shouldn't be such a bloody mandatory thing. If you want realism, hop off TI. There's your realism. Is it realistic that a child just turned 16 would be offered a very powerful position? No, it's not realistic in the slightest. But it happened because it was a game, and we are just meant to have fun, instead of nitpicking every god dang thing that breaks realism.

I would certainly agree to giving Storytellers the use of Staff restore commands if they don't have them already. It makes sense, and it could be easily narrated as the group stopping for a rest or whatever works. As has been mentioned elsewhere, the ST is akin to a D&D Game Master, they can narrate things as needed within the bounds of the theme and their approved story.

Voxumo, please stop being offensive to people that don't view TI in the same that you do and attempting to pigeonhole the motivations of others when no such things have been stated. This is not a console game and so the comparison is moot (further, it you want to play a console game, there are plenty out there). It is a intensive roleplaying simulation of a dark medieval fantasy setting, and there are various tropes and expectation that go along with that. One of those is people treating the theme, setting, system and one's fellow players with some respect.

EDIT 3: I also want to suggest, right off the bat, that we don't add in a system of characters getting hungry or suffering penalties for not eating. Systems like that generally turn out very un-fun.

We used to have a hunger system and it was removed- I think the chances are close to 0% of us ever returning to that.

[Puciek]

EDIT: Another suggestion - the armor situation might be helped by reducing the MV consumption rate of moving with armor, but adding an MV cost to putting it on, one at least large enough to offset the advantage of waiting until a dangerous situation pops up to don it all at once. This would only help, however, if the changes I suggested above were implemented, and the MV cost couldn't jus

I did suggest a solution for that in OP

[Voxumo]

I'm not being purposefully being offensive towards those who don't view TI in the same way I do. I'm just defending an opposite view. I'm presenting a view that plays TI not for realism, but for the fun. If you can't take an opposing view... well that's just your own issue. And Zeita, I do play plenty of Console games in my spare time. The comparison isn't moot. At the very core of TI, It is a game. A game is meant to be fun. Not something a person should be frustrated with because they are running into the same issues they run into in real life. I do not hop onto TI to simulate real life. I hop on it to have fun, to be able to do things I wouldn't be able to do because it's just not possible in real life. And sometimes people just have to look past realism in a GAME. Is putting on armor right before a battle, or restoring mv between fights really affecting you? No it's not. It's simply ruining the immersion for some people. I just find it amazing what people complain about that breaks immersion. Example, a noble going into a location they normally wouldn't just to get rp, which technically goes against theme. I'd consider that massive breaking of immersion, if I didn't understand the reasoning behind it, but no... putting on armor before combat and eating food to restore mv between fights is so much more immersion breaking.

But I could just have this warped view of the game, since TI: Legacy is the Only Mud I've ever played, and I haven't had the luxury of other similar roleplaying games like DnD. Or maybe because TI: Legacy is the only MUD I've played I've never experienced MUDs that are far more restrictive and not so carefree as TI has been. Who knows?

[Kinaed]

What an RP Mud is depends a lot on how its players choose to play the game.

In today's OOC Chat, it was a clear consensus that players generally prefer that other players do not do things in character that are not IC for the scene. Whereas I respect Voxumo's opinion, how people play on TI with regard to this particular item is now an agreed policy of the game. Therefore, it's viewed as cheating, and I'd request Voxumo to abide by TI policies.

I don't think there's any negatives in discussing people's views further, however. Perhaps the group that attended the OOC Chat was not representative of the pbase, or perhaps those who disagreed kept silent because they didn't feel up to the debate? I don't know, but I do know the rule that players are IC at all times has been around for a long time, so I don't think this is a surprise. Like someone said earlier, I think people just did it because it was accepted as standard behavior, not because anyone agreed that it was ICly appropriate to wear all.armor in the middle of meeting the Queen. Now it's not accepted. No big.

[Voxumo]

I just looked over the chat log. Here are the people who actively spoke up either fully or partially when Otois brought up the subject.
Otois
Galen
Margaux
Agden
Possibly Kato, seemed a bit unsure
Tomas Partially
Emma, the food issue specifically.

That's 7 people. or specifically 7 characters. 7 characters who went back and forth with each other on the topic. According to census there are currently 152 active players. Now likely many of those are players with multiple alts... Now not knowing the exact number of actual players, but the number of characters I created this rough idea. Let's say each player had 3 characters, that they were able to keep active, unlikely but just go with it. and there are 50 players. That would equal 150 characters, close to our current census of active characters. Now I imagine the number of actual players is much higher than 50, since I doubt the average player is able to play 3 different alts, and keep all three active.

My point is, I don't think 7 people at best count towards a clear consensus... Maybe in the meeting yeah it did... but outside the meeting there are alot more players.

But yeah, I intend to follow the policy, because really what choice do I have besides finding loopholes in the policy that allows me to manipulate it while staying in the guidelines of the policy.

[Puciek]

I just looked over the chat log. Here are the people who actively spoke up either fully or partially when Otois brought up the subject.
Otois
Galen
Margaux
Agden
Possibly Kato, seemed a bit unsure
Tomas Partially
Emma, the food issue specifically.

That's 7 people. or specifically 7 characters. 7 characters who went back and forth with each other on the topic. According to census there are currently 152 active players. Now likely many of those are players with multiple alts... Now not knowing the exact number of actual players, but the number of characters I created this rough idea. Let's say each player had 3 characters, that they were able to keep active, unlikely but just go with it. and there are 50 players. That would equal 150 characters, close to our current census of active characters. Now I imagine the number of actual players is much higher than 50, since I doubt the average player is able to play 3 different alts, and keep all three active.

My point is, I don't think 7 people at best count towards a clear consensus... Maybe in the meeting yeah it did... but outside the meeting there are alot more players.

And your assumption is that they all agree with your side? This is why we have this topic post meeting, so they can voice their opinion, they can also do so via pboard I guess if they dislike the forums. Heck I will be first one to yield that this is just stupid and bonkers if someone can explain to my "why".

[Voxumo]

I just looked over the chat log. Here are the people who actively spoke up either fully or partially when Otois brought up the subject.
Otois
Galen
Margaux
Agden
Possibly Kato, seemed a bit unsure
Tomas Partially
Emma, the food issue specifically.

That's 7 people. or specifically 7 characters. 7 characters who went back and forth with each other on the topic. According to census there are currently 152 active players. Now likely many of those are players with multiple alts... Now not knowing the exact number of actual players, but the number of characters I created this rough idea. Let's say each player had 3 characters, that they were able to keep active, unlikely but just go with it. and there are 50 players. That would equal 150 characters, close to our current census of active characters. Now I imagine the number of actual players is much higher than 50, since I doubt the average player is able to play 3 different alts, and keep all three active.

My point is, I don't think 7 people at best count towards a clear consensus... Maybe in the meeting yeah it did... but outside the meeting there are alot more players.

And your assumption is that they all agree with your side? This is why we have this topic post meeting, so they can voice their opinion, they can also do so via pboard I guess if they dislike the forums. Heck I will be first one to yield that this is just stupid and bonkers if someone can explain to my "why".

I never claimed I believed they all agree with my view. Heck that wasn't even my intention with stating that. My only point was to state that 7 players should not count as a general consensus of a game this size. Heck this topic didn't even have a chance to go up before the choice was already made, with the assumption that it was a general consensus playing into the factors of the choice.

[Applesauce]

While on topic, I can't say I've ever seen someone scarf food down while crafting ... It seems to only occur in combat situations.

I know this quote reflects only a minor part of the much larger topic, but people definitely scarf food while crafting. I know I personally do it, and through my PC shop I've sold a ton of food to merchants who have sent mail and/or tells thanking me for making it easier for them to craft. Anytime you're going to make more than a couple of things food is of great benefit. For people who are grinding skills it's a necessity.

More generally, I'm also a fan of the "over time" idea of food that has been suggested here. It would primarily affect these "urgent" combat scenarios while only inconveniencing the other use cases:

1) Crafting. When I go to craft a bunch of stuff, I never HAVE to make it all right away. If I have to make a few, eat, then rest or do something else for 10 minutes before getting back to crafting, that's totally fine with me. Less convenient, but not a problem IMO.

2) Hunting. Same here, if I'm out hunting, right now I hunt 'til I'm exhausted, eat up, then repeat. If I have to sit a while longer to wait for the food to "take effect", no biggie. With extremely few exceptions it will not matter if I get back to hunting right away or in a few minutes.

3) Fighting competitions / tournaments / training. This might be a slightly bigger pain just because someone wouldn't necessarily be able to win a fight and then immediately defend the title or whatever. So some scheduling would have to be done to let other people go between bouts, so that everyone has a chance to eat and rest up before their next fight. Seems fine, just would be more of an inconvenience than #1 or #2 since people are literally waiting for you in that same scene.

4) Life and death "real" combat. No more running after someone, stuffing your face when you catch them, then pummeling them into the ground.

Long story short, +1 vote for "rest recovers some MV on its own, food recovers MV over time" as long as it doesn't become a Coamjar situation where you can eat once then food becomes useless for like 30 minutes.

[Tremere]

I really think that you should regain movement just from standing around. Not as at great of a rate as resting, but I still think it should do some sort of recovery. That would really help this situation a lot more than other things. It would be a simple fix. I do understand why food is the way it does, it is a money sink and it gives food/drink a real purpose where they otherwise would not (and I for one am not in favor of doing the get hungry over time thing, I have always hated those systems because they just get annoying too quickly)

[BattleJenkins]

To Voxumo: Hey, calm down! I don't think it was necessary to try to bring up my character's own RP as a counterpoint to my suggestion, nor was it necessary to insinuate that I would enjoy the game more if realism took precedence over player enjoyment, especially when I raised the point in the OOC meeting that I wanted to make sure that player enjoyment took precedent over theme whenever possible. Obviously you're extremely invested in how it works currently, which I understand and respect, but please try not to get so heated.

Also, for the record, I definitely scarf food while crafting. Since cooking is one of the crafts my character practices, I have a whole cupboard full of food I've made to practice cooking, which I take out and eat whenever I practice other skills.

I do think that the economy drain aspect of MV and food can be preserved, even if food makes MV go up over time instead of instantly. Maybe a quick fix would be to keep everything how it is now with regards to the numbers, but just make the MV increase from eating happen gradually over a few minutes rather than right away?